Wideband Dyno Inside, Tuning Questions

[slow6]

viper04af:
fueling is controld buy the maf..... you should not have to worry about PE usless you are WOT [/QB]

so set PE enable to all 100% across? which is WOT

98camaro3.8:
VE doesn't have anything to do with normal ops.

You don't have to be in PE mode to command an AFR. You can set it seperately for Startup, Open Loop, Closed Loop, and PE. You don't need/want to run around town with a 13:1 AFR.

I believe that VE doesnt have anything to do with normal ops (Unless, you're MAF has failed) although, some people have told me that the VE helps do some calculations.

SO, how do you set your commanded AFR for OPEN & CLOSED loop?? Whats wrong with running around town with a 13:1 AFR? I would think that 13:1 is better than the stock tune. What would be the Ideal AFR?

foff says: 12.8:1 from 3700-4400 on the street & lean it out to 13.0-13.2 thereafter till peak hp then back to 13.0-12.9 after peak hp.

which is very specific and informative, thanks!

so, dont even trust your commanded AFR, I'm waiting 4 more days for the AEM wideband!
(No EIO yet)

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

Originally posted by slow6:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />viper04af:
fueling is controld buy the maf..... you should not have to worry about PE usless you are WOT

so set PE enable to all 100% across? which is WOT

98camaro3.8:
VE doesn't have anything to do with normal ops.

You don't have to be in PE mode to command an AFR. You can set it seperately for Startup, Open Loop, Closed Loop, and PE. You don't need/want to run around town with a 13:1 AFR.

I believe that VE doesnt have anything to do with normal ops (Unless, you're MAF has failed) although, some people have told me that the VE helps do some calculations.

SO, how do you set your commanded AFR for OPEN & CLOSED loop?? Whats wrong with running around town with a 13:1 AFR? I would think that 13:1 is better than the stock tune. What would be the Ideal AFR?

foff says: 12.8:1 from 3700-4400 on the street & lean it out to 13.0-13.2 thereafter till peak hp then back to 13.0-12.9 after peak hp.

which is very specific and informative, thanks!

so, dont even trust your commanded AFR, I'm waiting 4 more days for the AEM wideband!
(No EIO yet) [/QB]</font>[/QUOTE]foff says that becuase the dyno is not the same load as the street so your numbers will change some. and thats only for WOT

around town you should alway be at 14.7:1 AFR for max gas milage and low emmison if your at 13:1 the hole time you CAT wil die early...

[98Camaro3.8]

Originally posted by slow6:
so set PE enable to all 100% across? which is WOT

Stock setting is 80%, and that's about where it should be. If you're below 80% throttle, you're just driving around normally. Above that and you want max power.

Originally posted by slow6:
SO, how do you set your commanded AFR for OPEN & CLOSED loop?? What would be the Ideal AFR?

There's different places to set the open and closed loop AFR. I don't have HP Tuners, so I don't know what they call it. For normal driving around town you would set the closed loop setting. Stock should be 14.7:1, and that's exactly what you want. This is where the engine runs most efficiently (but not making max power).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoichiometric_air_ratio

Originally posted by slow6:
Whats wrong with running around town with a 13:1 AFR? I would think that 13:1 is better than the stock tune.

That's the dangers of tuning without really reading up on it first. Just because you want to be at 13:1 when WOT doesn't mean it's always better than stock.

[foff667]

"Stock setting is 80%, and that's about where it should be. If you're below 80% throttle, you're just driving around normally. Above that and you want max power."

so at 5000 rpms and 70% throttle you'd like & would feel safe with your a/f at 14.7:1?

"Just because you want to be at 13:1 when WOT doesn't mean it's always better than stock"

Just so I understand, you mean just because you want to put in a commanded afr at all times of 13.0:1 doesnt mean you'll actually get that as your final number...I just got done doing a tune yesterday where the commanded was at 11.7-12.0:1 and the actual afr was from 12.9-13.2:1

[slow6]

I completely understand now!
although stock HOT TPS Vs RPM is:
50 50 54 64 71 75 78 79 80 80 80 80 80 80 80 80 80
THANKS!!!

[98Camaro3.8]

Originally posted by foff667:

so at 5000 rpms and 70% throttle you'd like & would feel safe with your a/f at 14.7:1?

First of all, if that was going to cause the engine to explode, it probably wouldn't have been set like that from the factory.

But if that does scare you, change the value where it goes into PE at 5000 RPM to 60% or something. I didn't say you have to leave it at 80% and never even look at it again. My point was that you don't need to be in PE with 10% throttle at 2300 RPM.

Originally posted by foff667:

Just so I understand, you mean just because you want to put in a commanded afr at all times of 13.0:1 doesnt mean you'll actually get that as your final number...I just got done doing a tune yesterday where the commanded was at 11.7-12.0:1 and the actual afr was from 12.9-13.2:1

I'm not talking about commanded AFR, I mean actual AFR. Just because an AFR of 13:1 is good at WOT doesn't mean it's the best choice for cruising around town. Like Viper said, running that rich all the time will cause other problems (cat, emissions, etc).

[foff667]

i say that about tps cuz in most other v6/v8 applications you'll see tps enable at 20-30% above 4000 rpms.

I mustve misread his initial quote about running on the street at 13.0:1...i thought he meant 13.0:1 at wot.

[slow6]

you guys are THE SHIZZNIT!!
i'm soooo desiring my AEM which I worked hard for!
gas mileage is teh poooopo

[slow6]

cant find where to command an AFR for Open & CLosed though...

[98Camaro3.8]

All I can do to help is show what's in the HP Tuners manual:

Open Loop F/A vs. Coolant Temp vs. MAP: This table is used to determine the commanded AFR when in open loop mode. It divides the Stoich AFR value. AFR is determined by 14.7/table value. Example: 14.7/1.30 = 11.3 AFR

http://www.hptuners.com/gfx/edit-e.jpg

Not sure about closed loop, maybe it always runs at stoich? I have a setting in my DHP tuner to set the desired closed loop AFR.

Either way, you'd want to leave closed loop at 14.7:1, and open loop is probably set good where it's at.

[slow6]

ya, youre right
i probably should make sure open & closed is set to 14.7 via a wideband.

but my fuel control -&gt; "Open & Closed Loop" tab looks nothing like that. It doesnt have any of those functions. My 2 functions arent on there either.
Mine are the "Closed Loop Enable Delay" table and "Closed Loop Enable Coolant Temp"

So it looks like I cant change my open & closed if I wanted to..

[98Camaro3.8]

Originally posted by slow6:
i probably should make sure open & closed is set to 14.7 via a wideband.

It should already be correct at 14.7 in closed loop. That's why we have oxygen sensors. They can't be used for anything richer than that, but they work good for finding stoich.

[slow6]

so that excuse of "I'm gonna buy tunning software for better gas mileage"
is total bull$hit!

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

Originally posted by slow6:
so that excuse of "I'm gonna buy tunning software for better gas mileage"
is total bull$hit!

no but if you dont know how to tune then it dont matter

[slow6]

well, you Might be able to advance your timing Slightly (better mpg)